Banner Sponsors

Dilu Jun 14, 2005

I was off yesterday, So had the advantage of reading this topic from the begining....wow.....I am not surprised, because not much people do surprises me.  We had a pedophile at the psych hospital who was baby faced and pleasant and affable-and I used to live next door to Ted Bundy-  ( looks to die for and many did) 

First, I know it is sometimes hard for us to rise above the cruelty, me too, and I should SHOULD have the skills, right?  But we are human, or golly, or beary, and cruelty just insn't in our nature....but it is in many other people's nature.  I am so sorry when I hear about someone being mean to Judi, or  Shelli or Sue Ann..... or anyone I care about....

"You can't copywrite body parts"  THANK YOU JUDI!!!!  I have agonized....but then I joined here and I look at all the critters, gollys and bears alike, even though we use the same 'parts' the styles are so very very different; and I for one would be tickeled to own any a one of them....I aM HINTING TO MY HUBBYHONEY FOR ...what's next, birthday or Christmas....oh Christmas....long wait.....oh well

At anyrate- it isn't where we place the ears, or eyes, it is the essense that these critters are infused with that gives them their style, panache and character.  I can put my ears in the exact same place as Shelly, but will it be a Potbelly Bear?  (Not by a long shot  :D)

Those nasty people are really just speed bumps in the road, or as they say here in the backwoods Oregon, 'roadkill'.  *( there are those who might say dinner.)  Yewweeeee ugh!
The ladies here on this board- well all the regulars, seem to have such wonderful personalities and sweet spirits.  (come on you lurkers, we know you are reading....)

Thank you Laura for the information, cuz, I wouldn't have known it.  A word to the wise sort of thing.

I guess I have been lucky- nope never sold- just bought.  I had ordered a beer stein for hubbyhoney for Christmas.. antique, oh so wonderful, but it broke in shipment.  The man I bought it from could not have been nicer, and more fair.  All my buying experiences have been along this line.

To keep it in perspective; how many people live in the US... How many are in prison...percentage wise its pretty pretty small.....I want to believe that's the way the world goes.

When I lived in Germany I only had one run in with a truly nasty woman.....( and she was my mother in law!!!) :lol::lol:  Every single other person I ever came in touch with was wonderful....and my experience was fabulous.

Soooo buck girls and lets get selling?

Gollyloves to all

Dilu

Shelli Retired Help Advisor, Banner SponsorJun 14, 2005

I used to live next door to Ted Bundy-  ( looks to die for and many did)

Dilu, you are a warm and wise woman, but I could hardly ingest the rest of your warm and wise post because of what you wrote, above.

REALLY?!?!?

Judi Jun 14, 2005

I agree with you ladies about ebay having more positive than negative experiences...it's just that we tend to really remember the bad ones because they have often hurt us and we don't want to get hurt again.

Hopefully this will make us all more aware and stronger;)

Love the comment , Shelli,

"When you're a hammer, EVERYTHING looks like a nail."

There are a lot of hammers out there but we are not  all nails. ( at least not ALL the time!)

Marie_ Jun 15, 2005

Laura, thank you for the informaition!
I've bookmarked the site too.
I only buy from e-bay now, but I was thinking of selling on e-bay in future...

As Dilu said, I wouldn't have known
about these thing too (@@ 
I always wondered about people having there auction ID as "private" and now I know the reason...

Judi, Shelli, Rita and Laure and everyone,
thank you for sharing your story and I'm sorry that you all had to gone thru that. I think they are so jealous about your *true talent*.

Hugs/Marie

huggleybear Jun 15, 2005

I just received an email request in response to my current listing. They asked that I pull my bear off the auction, state the best price I would accept and they would pay me in two payments. I reported them to Ebay.  That has never happened to me since I started selling bears on Ebay. Has anyone else had this happen to them?

SueAnn Help Advisor, Banner SponsorJun 15, 2005

Heads up, Cindy!  I was lurking on the Edinburgh board just before I logged on here, and I saw the exact same post as yours but from a different person.  This sounds a lot like some sort of scam.  Did the person who requested this have MSG in his/her ID name??

huggleybear Jun 16, 2005

Absolutely!  I reported it to Ebay. Deleted it without resonding. I was immediately suspicious as soon as I read the email.

Laure Jun 16, 2005

Wow!  So glad you caught that, Cindy.  If/when I start selling there, I hope I have the quickness of wits to spot trouble like that. :rolleyes::o

doodlebears Celebration AmbassadorJun 16, 2005

I hope all this has not put any would be Ebay sellers from selling their work via Ebay. I know people can be a real pain reporting slight discrepancies that we have made but all and all Ebay is a great resource for us all to buy and sell through. Thanks for the tip I did not realise that I was breaking rules with my bear photographs as they have all have my url printed across the bottom I guess I am lucky that you have made me aware of my mistake. I will be sure not to add the url in the future.

Thanks all!

Jane.

Judi Jun 16, 2005

Cindy,
That has happened to me a few times.  I have had people ask me to end the auction early so they can buy my bear.  I even had someone call me on the phone recently to request this.  I don't think it is a scam of any kind but rather someone who desperately wants a certain bear.

  I respond to these kinds of emails in a positive friendly manner saying that ebay frowns on this and that is would hurt my reputation as a seller.  Also, there are people who wait until the last few minutes to place a bid so this would not be fair to them.

People have been very understanding when I explain to them like this.

I have also had people ask ," What is your buy-it-now price?"  Again I had to explain that I was very sorry but there was no buy-it-now-price.

Another good way to respond to nasty emails is to tell them that the only body parts they own are the ones they were born with.  I wish I had thought of that at the time.:D

Patscrafts Originals Jun 16, 2005

Hello, I was reading all the posts, and I felt I must put my 2 cents in on what happened to Judi and the "whites on the eyes' post. I don't mean to bash anyone but there are 2 sides to every story, I fell this one must be told.

I actually know the person in question about the "whites on the eyes". Her name is Lydia, and this had happened 3 maybe 4 years ago, when NOBODY was doing this, and to even see it on someones bear was unique. She even described it on her bears in technical terms. She was emailing Judi, complimenting her work, and Judi asked to see Lydias bears. she she emailed pics, and described her unique eyes. Within 10days, Judi has listed her VERY NEXT BEAR on Ebay with those very same eyes. Even describing the eye technique the VERY SAME WAY. Poor Lydia was crushed, this hurt her very badly, and I am sure she lost many nights sleep over this. And I don't blame her one bit! So you can see this wasn't an "Ebay" thing really, just that the copied technique was displayed on EBAY for all to see, as if it was an artist original. Judi had only been listing bears on Ebay for a little over a year, had already built up a following, and to introduce this technique on her bears was easy, since her bears were changing weekly, but its wrong in my view. Now, 4 years later,everyone does it, but when it happened, and how it happened was more than a coincidence. The thing is, she didn't wait 4 years, it was immediate.   

I must also say, this was not the 1st time I have heard this kind of story from artist friends of mine. I do feel there are always 2 sides to every story, and someone had to stick up for Lydia. I am sure this incident almost ruined her, personally and professionally. She only listed bears a handful of times, and it was after Judi had claimed the technique as her own, so Lydia looked really bad when she did list her own bears. She swore off Ebay soon after that.   

Sorry Judi, I dont mean to be so blunt, but the truth had to be told here.

Judi Jun 16, 2005

Isn't it a shame  that bear artist's cannot be more supportive of each other.
I was not the first to use whites in the eyes of bears.  I had seen this used a very long time ago in a magazine...far before Lydia's.  Many many many artist's add the whites to a bears eyes. 

Patscrafts post borders on Libel.  Libel is written defamation.  Defamation, sometimes called "defamation of character", is spoken or written words that negatively reflect on a living person's reputation.

If a person publicaly says or writes something about you that is understood to lower your reputation, or that is an attempt to keep people from associating with you, defamation has occured.

The above is exactly what this is..pure and simple.

  It is a shame how things get twisted and taken right out of context to deliberately hurt another person, and  it saddens me a great deal to see such ugliness on such a wonderful board.:(

kbonsall Jun 16, 2005

Judi - regardless of whose "idea" it was, your work is WONDERFUL and no one can take that away from you!  Everyone has their own style of how they do certain things.  I am not siding with anyone - I dont want to get in the middle - there is no reason to hurt feelings -

Laure Jun 16, 2005

Please, Oh, Please, lets keep our posts loving.  
When I introduce a technique, I assume that once someone sees it, it's public domain.  If someone wants to use something that looks similar, I have no legal or moral right to expect otherwise.  I heard of another dispute over having a bear's hands behind their back.  I think it's foolish to think we own an idea.  That's just how it is in art.  This is how the artform as a whole evolves.  It's the same in any art form, whether it's painting, music, teddy bears, or whatever.  There are innovations that become trends.    

I hope I will always remember to see my own creativity from the following paradigm: " Every good and perfect gift comes to us from God, the creator of all light..." [James 1:17]  It never belonged to me in the first place.

Judi Jun 16, 2005

Bless you Laure ansd Kim-Bee.  I agree with you whole heartedly.

huggleybear Jun 17, 2005

I agree with Laure and the quote at the end of her post. We must keep this a forum for love and support of our fellow artists so that we can continue to help each other and offer ideas to one another.

Judi, you are such a sweet and helpful person, please do not let this damage you in any way. You have helped me many times and I in turn will help anyone else that may need it. Isn't what this board is about? Helping each other and sharing tips and ideas and being supportive of each other. I feel that is what makes bear artists a special group of individuals.

huggleybear Jun 17, 2005

I also wanted to add that the person who requested that I end my auction so they could buy my bear actually bid on my bear that is up on Ebay and she has nothing but positive feedback.

I had never had this happen to me before so I just assumed that it was a scam of sorts. Thank you for your response Judi letting me know that this has happened to you before and it is just someone who possibly wanted my bear so much that she made this request. If it ever happens again, I will certainly, as you suggested, answer her with kindness and explain why I cannot end my auction early for all of the reasons that you mentioned. Thanks again for your help and advice. You are a true asset to all of us.

bearsbybeesley Jun 17, 2005

I dont know? I want everyone to feel comfortable with ebay but I do find it a bit of dod eat dog world. Fortunately I have not had these problems but I will also add I have little luck with listings on ebay. I realize my name is not well known but I guess I must keep listing to get it out there.

Hugs Louise

Delartful Bears Jun 17, 2005

Oh gee, can we PLEASE keep it nice in here.  Leave your personal feelings about members off the board.

Yes Louise - keep listing!!  Someone who gets very nice prices on eBay told me it took her a whole two years to get a decent price on eBay, and that was with listing one bear EVERY week. So, there's hope for you and I still LOL

Eileen Jun 17, 2005

This is really too bad.

Judi's probably the last person in the world who would do anything mean or ungenerous, or steal a creative technique.  It sounds to me as if Pat's friend Lydia "reinvented the wheel", as they say, without knowing it.  It happens. I think it's unlikely that any 'original' technique is really original. This doesn't make the discovery less thrillling, but it does mean that we need to be very careful of claiming ownership.

I'm sure that Pat is reporting her friend's perspective accurately, but intensity of feeling doesn't prove its cause. The real cause seems to have been an unfortunate combination of misunderstanding and envy. It's a lethal combination, and it's clearly caused her a lot of pain.

I love your bears, Pat, and I understand your loyalty to your friend, but this forum is the wrong place for a vendetta. It's ok to start a general thread about originality, but to attack an individual in the name of 'truth' isn't likely to help your friend.

Eileen

kbonsall Jun 17, 2005

Eileen - I totally agree - I came into this board for support, not to witness people being ucky to one another   This is suppose to be a fun forum and a fun hobby Please don't scare me away from this forum by getting ucky

Wisdom Bears Jun 17, 2005

Well Said Eileen, I can only agree with all you have said. We are here to support each other ,not condemn. Surely this did not have to be done through the group at all really. Lets put it all behind us now and start afresh.Let lessons be learned from it.  Back to my bears.Hugs Rita xxx

Judi Jun 17, 2005

AMEN!!:):):)  Let's get back to the happy forum:):):)

Shelli Retired Help Advisor, Banner SponsorJun 17, 2005

Let's get back to the happy forum:):):)

Thanks to the grace, kindness, complexity, and caretaking of the members of TEDDY TALK, I think we're already "there."

Bravo, ladies.

Judi Jun 17, 2005

What a family we have here.  You are all a joy!!!